Healthcare Advertising With a Human-First Approach

In order for the healthcare system to meet new the demands presented not just by COVID but by an increasingly aging and diverse population, the system and those who work within it will need a human-first approach – even in its advertising.

The advertising of pharmaceuticals directly to consumers often puts them in an active role in their treatment. But with regulatory requirements, even the strongest creative involves a delicate balance. Brand marketers want and need to communicate with insight in order to create branded memories, just like advertising in any other category.  

Revisit our on demand webinar featuring Ipsos’ Alexa Marshall and numerous guest experts in the pharma space describing how they bring the human-first approach into the process: 

• Patrick M. Armstrong, AstraZeneca Senior Manager Insights & Analytics, US Respiratory and Immunology
• Akash Lall, Bristol Myers Squibb Manager, Immunology Customer & Market Insights
• Allysha Najdowski, 21GRAMS VP Account Director

Alexa Marshall is a senior vice president in Ipsos’ Creative Excellence service and DTC Pharmaceutical Advertising Center of Excellence Lead. Alexa has 20 years’ experience supporting clients in the development of effective advertising with brand and communications research, with a focus on the DTC Pharma category. She is a passionate advocate for nurturing creativity to grow successful brands.  In her leadership role for the Ipsos Creative Excellence Pharmaceutical Center of Excellence Alexa curates best practice and core learnings across the pharma advertising space.  

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Today’s AI-generated audio transcript is offered below. Apologies in advance for inconsistencies that have been included.

0:05

Thank you for joining us for today's Ipsos webinar, Exploring Healthcare Advertising with the Human First Approach. Today's guest panelists are seasoned pharma advertisers. And you will hear more about them shortly.

0:20

Throughout today's session, you will remain in listen only mode. However, throughout the webinar, you may submit questions online using the Q and A feature.

0:31

Our plan is to answer questions at the end of today's session however, if time run short thing, your question will be answered by e-mail.

0:40

I also encourage you to check out the handouts we've uploaded into the webinar control panel.

0:46

Today's webinar is being recorded and will also be directly e-mailed to you.

0:52

So now without further ado it is my pleasure to introduce today's moderator Alexa Marshall Senior Vice President with Ipsos' Creative Excellence Pharmaceutical Center of Excellence.

1:05

Alexa, you have the floor.

1:08

Great. Thank you, Elen. And thank you, everyone, for taking the time today to join us.

1:14

We're here today to talk about my favorite topics which is advertising, and specifically DTC, pharmaceutical Advertising in particular.

1:27

And so just to kinda kick off, The premise of this really is that we know that great ads need to be great ads no matter what the category.

1:35

And that DTC Advertising is still Advertising, despite some unique challenges that they have to tend to work with.

1:46

But at the end of the day, DTC advertizing still has to gain attention of the Target Audience.

1:53

It has to link back to the brand well, and it has to motivate that target patient to take whatever intended action is, is warranted.

2:05

So as I mentioned, though, we know that DTC advertising is unique in certain ways, It differs in that we have to typically work with unusual, or hard to pronounce brand names, deliver complex messages, and oftentimes multiple messages in a single spot.

2:23

And do so with a required fair balance that often takes up a significant chunk of time of, let's say, a typical DTC video spot.

2:33

So, the premise of our discussion today is really to talk about how advertisers can succeed with these category unique challenges, while knowing that the basic principles of advertising really still hold in terms of what it has to do to be successful.

2:54

We've got five MIDI topics to cover today during the next 25 minutes or so, and we've assembled a fantastic panel of expert practitioners here to help us understand how they think about TTC advertising and have used successful ways to kind of navigate these challenges.

3:15

So, with that, I would like to, I've been introduced, so I would like to have my panel introduce themselves, and Alicia, if I could start with you to kick off a little bit about cloud.

3:29

Hi everyone, my name is ..., which is part of our well publishing.

3:37

Great, awesome cash.

3:39

Sure, thanks so much. And thanks will accept for having us as part of the panel, My Name is ...

3:44

I am a manager personal, Higher Squib part of the customer and market insights team currently supporting immunology specifically on ..., which is an oral medication for ....

3:57

Thanks Aakash and Patrick.

4:02

Good afternoon, good evening, or good morning, wherever you may be in the world.

4:06

I'm Patrick Armstrong, senior Manager Insights Analytics, I'm based in Wilmington for astra zeneca. I sit within our global insights analytics center of excellence.

4:22

I'm aligned with the US business. Primarily support our respiratory portfolio.

4:28

And I work closely with our commercial and sales leadership teams to help inform them with evidenced decision evidence based decision making to opioid form a product strategy and tactics.

4:45

Um, and so our organization isn't a truly data driven organization.

4:51

Advertising is an instrumental part of that.

4:55

And one of the pillars of our organization is patient, patient centricity, it really drives what we do every day and I can tell you that I work with some really incredible people are dedicated to that goal.

5:10

So thank you for having me today.

5:11

Thanks, Patrick. Appreciate it.

5:15

So, without further ado, I wanted to get into the first of the five topics.

5:19

And the first one that we want to really talk about is branding, Brand linkage, branding, and why brand sort of memory devices are really key. And so, you know, as I mentioned earlier, we know that pharmaceutical brands often have challenges with challenging names, challenging names to pronounce, so on and so forth.

5:42

You know, they're novel words, novel words, not normal, not within the usual day to day nomenclature, if you will.

5:51

And to that end, that could pose a unique challenge to really aligning, garnering brand memorability.

6:01

So, it seems like it's a little bit more of like key importance in this particular category. That creative really has to kind of go beyond just showing the brand name, showing the logo as kind of table stakes and cost of entry.

6:14

And, really, that achieving strong brand linkage requires really building distinctive brand assets and memorable features that can really help the brain tie back to the specific brand name.

6:28

Um, and doing that, you know, we've known from our research, that different branding devices.

6:36

You can see here in terms of what's being shown on this slide, unique colors, the campaign consistency or continuity, certain jingles, ensuring brand integration, using unique characters. Those are types of things that often we see within pharma that tend to aid in terms of brand Mount memorability.

6:59

So, Patrick, if I can start with you on this topic.

7:04

Thinking of times within the creative development process, you know, when, for one of your brands, you know, how have Or have you thought about these particular aspects, as it pertains to how you think about creative development and leveraging these to really instill that Brand Memorability?

7:24

It's a topic that we're very much focused on every day. I can tell you that.

7:30

Just to go back to something that you had mentioned, Alexa, at the outset was the fact that oftentimes the therapeutic assets that we put into market have difficult to pronounce names them.

7:45

As consumers of health care, I think we're all familiar with that.

7:49

We've all struggled to pronounce those names at times and I think they, perhaps the average person might not realize, but there's a reason why that's the case.

8:01

We're held to certain standards by the FDA, just in terms of the product naming itself, There are certain guidelines that we have follow such as the name, not being misleading about what the drug is capable of treating, for example, um, or perhaps what the drug is made of.

8:21

The drug can't be used for. The drug name can't be used for promotional messaging.

8:28

There are often root words or other language that could be construed as having a bad connection. And so those are things that we also have the pressure test when we think about living a particular therapy.

8:42

And they can't be too similar.

8:44

And I think that's probably one of the most important reason's.

8:47

So, the goal is to ultimately prevent any confusion amongst patients, but also prescribers when they're thinking about prescribing those medications to their patients.

8:58

So, safety is a, a critical factor.

9:01

Um, and so, yes, I mean, we're very much aware of the other challenges of memorability where we're aware of the challenges pronunciation.

9:12

So, there are a few things from a D C perspective that we can use to help overcome some of those challenges. one of those things that we can do includes repetition.

9:24

So we have found that repeating a brand name of the product early and often both visually and audibly, it helped to solidify the brand equity, that brand recognition and long term memory.

9:40

Another thing that we can turn to is using mnemonic devices or techniques, as ways to, again, help help when memorize the effectively using phrases or ideas that have patterns to them.

9:56

Yeah, you can include poems, rhymes, images, acronyms, there's a couple ways to go about it.

10:05

Um, another technique that in recent years has really taken off informa is using user properties.

10:16

So, depending on the target audience, one might want to select music that's relevant from a particular decade or a particular error to really hit home with that relevance and familiarity.

10:30

Yeah, so all of those things can help, again, just foster familiarity engagement with the brand and its association.

10:38

Um, great, just a couple of quick examples.

10:43

Um, so again, I work in India respiratory.

10:47

Grocery is my main focus and we have some mnemonic devices worked into and our current spot. If you have COPD. Ask your doctor about Registry.

10:58

Trilogy, which is at GSK product our competitor for a number of years.

11:03

They've had a Trilogy 1 2 3 campaign for Jackson.

11:09

Tremendously popular.

11:11

And that acid is very strong or brand recognition.

11:16

You all probably heard the Olympic commercial that uses the, the song titled Magic by Pilots.

11:24

So those are just a few examples are aimed at driving the memorability and that stickiness factor.

11:31

That's great.

11:32

Thanks, Patrick and a cash, you know, to that end, just turning to you on this.

11:38

We know that, um, branding in and of itself is a challenge for a brand, but then you when you're advertising something in a crowded category, on top of everything, you know, with lots of competition that are that's running consistently. So, how have you specifically approach this, You know, with respect to you, as Patrick gave some really great examples.

11:59

But from your standpoint, you know, leveraging no sort of memorable elements.

12:04

or techniques like alliteration, or anything like that to help drive to how have you help drive that on what you're working on.

12:14

Absolutely. It's something we're thinking a lot about right now, just to contextualize it for the audience and for everyone here. We, you know, being in the psoriasis space. It's a very crowded market. There are many competitors that exist right now, both oral products as well as injectable biologics, first and second generation product. So all of these competitors are definitely taking a lot of noise. They have various different BTC campaigns running and different tactic, by which they are trying to capture the attention of a ....

12:46

Not being said, it's a very crowded. one thing, though, that we hear a lot of times when we're doing research with patients, is that they may or may not be familiar with some of the different DTC campaigns. And if they are, they sometimes have trouble associating a particular campaign with a particular product. So I think that part, part, the underscores, the problem we're trying to solve for the second piece of that too, is psoriasis is a space where patient requests plays a really important role.

13:15

There's definitely consideration for HTTPS when there Product if the patient comes in, and they say, Oh, I've heard of whatever competitive product it is. Definitely does payroll in the mind, a VAT.

13:27

And it definitely raises awareness and potential risks.

13:31

That being said, a crowded market with the role of teacher DTC is super important to us. So I think Patrick outline so many different great techniques that we can potentially leverage. A couple of things that we're thinking about, right?

13:44

Because as you said, Alexa, some of these names are hard to pronounce. Some of them are difficult to remember.

13:50

one thing is potentially using alliteration in a quick and easy, catchy tagline to, you know, to rhyme or to go along with the brand name top of mind so that hopefully when the patient gets to the doctor's office, it can easily remember that tagline.

14:05

Have the product name top of mind.

14:07

However, I think that one of the issues is that hard to remember. We also have to go with specific Creative elements that stand out really well. Because sometimes the patient might get to the doctor, and I remember the brand name at all.

14:19

So, is there a specific creative element we can introduce as part of our campaign?

14:24

Know, is it a animated logo?

14:26

So when they get to the doctor's office, they say, Oh, I want, I want the drug with, with the dancing animation or something like that. Is it, you know, another opportunity to sort of stand out or element that stopping power, so they can at least remember some aspect of the campaign. Hopefully, the doctor and patient, they'll remember the product.

14:47

That's great, thanks ... for that. And so, Alicia, from a creative samphire, right, so an agency standpoint, you know, from that perspective, knowing that it's so important to begin with.

15:01

And really think about early, early, early on, in the, in the process, and knowing the unique challenges, obviously, that we've just we've all we've all mentioned, so how do you approach that?

15:11

from, from a creative perspective in an end?

15:15

Does it differ, um, for how you think about TTC versus other categories? Like, would you would you have a different process?

15:23

Are not yeah, for the agencies preside outside of that concept, inquiry is one of our favorite things to do.

15:29

And especially on income, part of it to the memory device is .... So you look into our research regardless of we're doing DTC, or another advertising, there's still humans, new style patients new, still buying something, and talking to a doctor to still take it as the same approach in our opinion.

15:49

We do Lean out Ally, is there are other market research you can lead into, we have lexicons, those things going into right here. So if it's not just the brand name, there's other areas you could do to start figuring out what kind of language you need to capture into your ads, based on language are already using in the market.

16:05

Are already trying to say, just leveraging those little bit more, Uganda consulting fees, if you're looking at all of that. And this is a long process, it's nothing that happens overnight, it takes your day-to-day team, it's pulling other team members from other creative teams within your agency, and they're working day, and night they're going to the grocery store. They're thinking about it. They're working midnight. As a collaborative brainstorming. Together, it's a long process.

16:31

And end of the day, like, it's thinking about everything in there, like, there's parts, we've talked about two and here is your target market and could end up being one of these.

16:40

one of these Ads could be about realizing your target market is 60, Plus, you know what media channels there, and, you know, what kind of things are interested in? And just adding that to the concept you're working on. Do you need that nostalgic song? That goes with the app?

16:55

Right?

16:56

Yeah. That's great. That's great perspective. Thank you for that.

17:02

Transitioning to the second topic, which is really around Actually, I'm sorry.

17:09

Um, Around relevance and information. It's all about relevance. That's the second topic here.

17:16

And what I think is interesting is that, perhaps, surprisingly, what we have found is that DTC ads actually tend to break through more than the average ad.

17:27

And this could be because you're trying to reach very targeted, very specific, targeted people that are attuned to the message and attuned to what you're trying to say.

17:38

But to that end, we do see, and the data shows here that, generally speaking, DTC ads for people like Me, and relevant is relevant to me.

17:50

Those are things that really stand out in general, more so than when we look at just the All Category average on the same metrics. So, Akasha, I'd love to start with you on this one.

18:03

And I know that, you know, one of the ways that you've addressed this is by bringing patients into the creative development process, as are pretty early on to really understand what is most meaningful and what's most relevant to them.

18:21

And so, could you speak a bit about this in terms of the things that you've done that's helped your teams really get to the point where then, from an advertising standpoint, you really know you're hitting the mark in terms of relevance.

18:36

Absolutely, and I think one of the key things that we have to consider and crafting these DTC campaigns, these ads, is taking a step back and really getting a foundational understanding of how our patients think, feel, Act, behave. Well, this treatment, an emotional journey that is in group.

18:55

So, as a market researcher, I think one of the key things that we do is really get a foundational knowledge through various different types of studies.

19:03

For example, launch as we have right now for psoriasis. We're doing everything we can to understand patients. Who are these patients have collected experience, and what did they go through? You can imagine some of the key kinds of studies and research that we're doing, right?

19:18

It's the patient treatment journey. It's patient messaging, and then eventually patient segmentation. And through each of these different pieces of research, we are able to start understanding you, know, really how we can best communicate and speak to these patients.

19:34

Because making things relevant to them comes from understanding who they are in through can translate that into meaningful. And so before we even get to the stage of asking the BTC, it's really going through the entire process of understanding them.

19:51

Once we have understood broader universe, if you will, of patients who await the condition, can drill down in for specific segments and targets and then say, Here's how we want to appropriately for their attention.

20:05

That's great.

20:06

And, and building on that, Patrick with your COPD focus.

20:13

You know, when you think about creative development, what's the mindset or approach that you're taking to sort of ensure that, you know, the final touch points that you're producing are relevant to your target target audience?

20:29

Again, great question, and for consensus with everything that cost said.

20:35

So, look, I mean, we tend to conceptualize a patient as this abstract thing, but the patient is a patient, as myself, right? I mean, we're all, we're all, We all are all consumers of, health care, at one time or another.

20:50

And so it's important to keep that in mind.

20:53

And so, it's, I think, keeping that spirit, keeping that focus, and looking to speak to your target target audience, on a human level.

21:03

Understanding what their basic needs, their desires, are: personal experiences.

21:09

Health care, disease pathology is an extremely personal finance, restrict, extremely stigmatized, and embarrassing topic.

21:18

And so, we've got to be very tactful and thoughtful in how we approach those topics.

21:26

Um, COPD, for example, is a very emotional disease.

21:32

And we also, we often find that there's a disconnection between the rational and the emotional experience that folks undergo as they come to terms with, with the disease and what it means for them.

21:47

It's a progressive disease that happens period of time, unfortunately.

21:53

Um, and so, part of what we intend to do through our, our campaigns is creating moments of meaning through that storytelling.

22:06

Some of that is as addressing the unmet need in that disease space, that some of those meeting, sort of meeting the patients, where they are, connecting with what's most important to them.

22:18

So, as an example, again, going back to the spot that we have on, on television at the moment, for grocery, um, for those who experience COPD, especially more severe disease, they're often restricted in the daily activities that they can do.

22:40

They have increased difficulty with breathing.

22:43

They're not able to go out. And enjoy activities with their family, paulin pollutants.

22:48

Other things can call's flare, ups, and inflammation, and so they're not out. They're not able to get out and enjoy things with their, their family and their friends, as they once were.

22:59

So in our spot, again, it's, it's crafted in such a way that it presents the problem, and grocery is the solution.

23:11

And there's visual imagery in there that shows a woman who's able to get back out and have a picnic with her family in the park.

23:21

And that's, you know, so that those kinds of things tend to be more more aspirational.

23:26

I mean, what's desired?

23:30

Providing that kind of support in our advertisements, that folks can hopefully get on therapy that allows them to get back to some sense of normalcy and enjoy their time with their friends and family.

23:44

That's great. Thank you for that.

23:47

Just in the interest of time, because I actually know I jumped over one topic, I'd love to, Alicia, if I can, jump to the next topic, actually.

23:56

And have you lead off on this one, get your perspective in terms of driving more creativity into the process.

24:04

So this particular topic is really interesting.

24:07

and I think, from, from our perspective, you know, we know that we've seen how and just discussed for Patrick and akasha, how, you know, relevant advertising and informative advertising as some of the data showed, really does tend to drive attention. That being said, interestingly, in the pharma category.

24:25

And as we can see here, um, know, there is this sentiment of the sea of sameness, right? That most, most of the ads are slice of life. And, you know, coming back to the fact that, that one of the challenges is around fair balance, and having to work that in from a creative standpoint. We do see there isn't typically a lot of variety in terms of pharma advertising, and 97% of the ads that we test have actually been coded as slice of life.

24:57

So, some opportunities there to get a little, to maybe see if there are ways to drive more creativity.

25:03

So from your perspective, Alicia, just wanted to understand kind of your thoughts on the creative development process around how you're truly developing the creative as it pertains to pharma, given what we typically see.

25:17

And maybe some, maybe some insights as to why you might think that. There's a lot of you know, sort of sea of sameness. If you will be. I think every single time, somebody who's about to kick off a new concept for a TV spot, they want to avoid doing that.

25:30

Another bargain, we keep seeing the same things over and over the market, and we wanna try to do something that's going to take a little bit in a different way and get the patients to go and ask their doctor about this prescription and requested itself. So, for example, mind, my, most of my industry has been in oncology. That's a sensitive topic.

25:50

There's a lot you need to say in a short period of time. And there are challenges with perhaps a few times of conversations like that fair balanced, that takes up half of your ad. But there's still a way that you can go into telling a story and not just have a slice of life. It could be even setting up the problem the very beginning of like, if you are, I worked in prostate cancer, so it is yarn PSA rising, These patients are hyper focused on it. So what is going to grab their attention early on and not just show that one moment in their life. So it's something they've been focused on for probably the past 5, 10 years of their lives. If it's the loved one, even if it's our loved ones, even to these, what these loved ones are very involved in their prostate cancer, any type of cancer. Any kind of disease state they have. So, it's going to be relevant to both, just that patient and a caregiver, and then still trying to get that emotional pull through as you're going through fair balance.

26:43

And the day going with the call to action.

26:46

There are ways are still avoid that slice of life and only show that one moment happening in our life, and try to show a little bit more happening, and how it's going to make a difference.

26:54

And they're gonna have a benefit to being on a treatment or changing treatments.

27:00

OK, that's great.

27:01

And I'm gonna go a little off script here, but one other question for Patrick or Akasha on this one, just because, I do want to hit the D&I quite a topic.

27:10

The next topic to close out the webinar, but just from a client's standpoint, is there an expectation, or sort of a acknowledgment that ads will typically be slice of life? Or, Do you ever push on the creative? Do you ever push on Alicia, for example? two, Too.

27:30

Have some, from a creative standpoint, be a little bit more unique or different. Knowing what typical advertising, DTC Pharma Advertising typically looks like, Either one of you.

27:40

A little off script here, but just curious to your thoughts I'm happy to start, Patrick. If you if we want to tag Team to question.

27:47

Yeah, I think the Alexa, It's a really important consideration for us, um, that being said, it's an interesting challenge to solve for, right?

27:55

On the one hand, we often hear that a consumer can tell when an ad looks, pharma, right? Like, they know, based on The Slice of Life, they tell us, This looks very Pharma typical.

28:05

On the other hand, I think sometimes we present something very out of the box, maybe something a little bit more. For a goal, or, you know, that involves a lot of, you know, deeper level thinking. It's too much to take in in a quick 62nd ad, so we really have to strike the right balance.

28:19

And what I will say is, for us, what we've been doing is bringing patients into the creative development process very early on. So, rather than testing fully final concepts, maybe in Storyboard or even no animated videos, we've actually been bringing patients in in the rudimentary very overall concept stage.

28:38

So we presented them maybe a mood board, and maybe, you know, a paragraph describing what our concept intent is, and bring them in there at that point, so you can work together with them and drive creative that's actually meaningful. Hopefully, strike that balance.

28:56

Patrick, any additional thoughts on that one?

29:00

Yeah, and, again, in full consensus, we we go through many rounds of research, bringing those stakeholders and to really get their their thoughts, opinions, feelings, as we go along because we want it to be relevant to them.

29:16

Again, I mean, I think, I think, Oh, gosh, hit the nail on the head.

29:20

I think we see this sameness, right? It's not because Slice of life doesn't work.

29:25

It does, but it's just that everyone's doing it. And so, it tends to sort of wash out, and it just becomes more of a noise instead of a signal.

29:34

And so, um, there, there's a I know, my team, There's been a heavy focus to do more innovative techniques from a period of specter to stand out from the crowd.

29:48

... being one of those examples. So Simba Core goes on.

29:53

It's no longer but it was on television for a long time.

29:56

And there was the wolf camp.

29:58

And, again, just to go back to this topic of sameness, again, there's that there's, there's actually some benefits to Sandra's.

30:06

We've all seen the whether it's the x-men or Marvel movies that are in their sixth, seventh, eighth iteration, we kind of see those same techniques in pharma advertising as well. So for ...

30:19

Wolf, I believe that there were 5 or 6, what we call pullouts that were created, that built on the previous spot, and so it was using that brand equity, that we have built using that familiarity, but introducing some new life into it, to continue that campaign all along. And that was from that regard, it was a tremendously successful campaign.

30:44

And for ..., we're in our second iteration, so we are utilizing our target real framework where we start the commercial and an animated world.

30:58

It's an animation is now out.

31:00

So it's intended to be captivating and engaging and, like, different right from the other pharmaceutical commercials that are always the thing on TV.

31:10

And so as a cause, again, said, we don't want it to be so abstract that there's so much crammed into a 62nd spot, that it doesn't make any sense.

31:21

Yeah.

31:22

Balanced in such a way that the majority of folks are able to understand what that situation or what that story is that were there.

31:32

Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate that.

31:34

I know, we're over time. But for those Hardie souls who would like to stay on, I did want to just talk about one more topic. Get to get everyone's thoughts briefly on that. And that's the topic of diversity and inclusion.

31:49

And, so, just very quickly, from my end, you know, we know from data that I'm showing up here, to, to, to summarize very briefly, you know, we do know that on average, consumers are really feeling that advertisers can be doing more in this space.

32:11

And, in fact, you know, again, more just more generalized data that we have, just saying, you know, really wanting to see more people of color being depicted in positions of power.

32:24

Having women be seen in more like decisive and accomplished ways and, it kind of interestingly, ties to the slice of life conversation in terms of how you, how you actually do that.

32:35

But just wanted to just get very quick bytes from each of you on this topic, because it obviously is very important, and I know that companies are thinking about, this. Brands are thinking about this. Even more.

32:50

So, Alicia, if I could just quickly get a few nuggets on your thoughts in terms of just, you know, for you having that, having an important How important having like a diverse team is, in terms of, like, a creative Development Team to really ensure that you're developing creative. That's, you know, culturally authentic. So, just a couple of thoughts from you on that would be great. And, I think all companies are now are taking this very seriously. They want, they're looking at this as a whole from the very beginning of any idea. So, for example, in an agency perspective, we you still have your day-to-day team, but we take all kinds opting out further. We have internal teams that we don't have a diversity. So it's different races, genders, it's ages, and we could take a larger, any idea, and that's come out, like, it's things that you wouldn't even think about. For example, we're recently, we're gonna do a contract scene with one of our Photoshoots, and we were thinking about this, a lot of us live in larger cities and have moved, But, we like New York City's a melting pot!

33:51

So, a lot of us have moved into that of our, from our rural areas. Kolchak made sense, and I build a New York City, Northern Jersey. But when you are advertising to all United States, it actually may not make sense.

34:05

So, having that diverse are groups together to like think, and just like, feel comfortable, talking out loud, and can make a difference in a campaign. Or even down the road, the messaging. Anything in that aspect of it.

34:20

That's great.

34:21

Appreciate that, yeah, it's, yeah.

34:23

When you really step out and think broader than kind of your, your particular situation, it makes a difference.

34:29

That's really helpful, Akashi, briefly, I know, we talked about how, you know, advertising psoriasis, an interesting one in terms of just skin color and how people, you know, how people of color have or have not really seen themselves represented in advertising specifically related to this condition.

34:49

So if you wouldn't mind, just just talk a little bit about that and how you've approached that.

34:57

Yeah, absolutely.

34:58

And to your point, Alexa, one of the things that we were chatting about quite recently, right, is this idea that in dermatology and particularly psoriasis, it has been challenging. I think, historically, to diagnose skin conditions in patients of color. It often leads to different misdiagnoses or longer treatment journeys, in terms of getting patients to the appropriate treatment, and making sure that they have the correct arises, diagnosis.

35:23

And you can imagine the impact that has on patients physically, for sure, but also emotionally, olango treatment journey.

35:30

So, one of the things that we're keeping very acutely aware is the fact that a condition like psoriasis does impact individuals of various different races and ethnicities, and this representation is intentional.

35:44

It's not something that, no, I think it's being done just out of these tying D&I in to our campaign, and our thought processes.

35:53

But actually, because this is a condition that does affect people from all races, all ethnicities, all walks of life. So we're doing our best to really represent that.

36:03

The other thing I'll add quickly, I know we're short on time, is the idea that capturing the patient's attention and really connecting with them can often transcend what you're showing, also ties into the emotional connect that you're trying to go. As you can get even beyond the beach and look like me, you can show them emotionally speaking and able to connect with this campaign.

36:24

I should, by tying that in as well.

36:26

Yeah, absolutely, that's great.

36:29

That's great, and Patrick, the last word here.

36:31

You've done a lot of early stage work with us, and in fact, I think, from a positive standpoint, actually got some favorable feedback with respect to what you were testing in terms of how you were portraying different races and ethnicities, genders, and so on and so forth. So maybe just a quick blurb on that, and then how, you know, that is, is a key sort of part of your creative development process to consider.

36:59

D&I, pretty substantially.

37:02

So I'll turn it to you for the last word.

37:06

And, this is, there's a lot to unpack here, and I don't think we have time for it today, unfortunately. But, it's an extremely important topic.

37:17

Something that really permeates our organization from from top to bottom and it's very much true.

37:23

Or what we do with our campaigns as well.

37:28

So, I mean, the goal right is to reach for diverse audience.

37:33

Not now, not only because all brands should seek to market in such a way that reflects our world, but it could literally be a matter of life and death.

37:45

I'm sorry to go back to what I said at the beginning.

37:48

Um.

37:49

of this conversation right.

37:51

Was that our core goal is patient centricity and getting the right medication to the right patients.

37:58

Um, I would I would call out and encourage your checkout test buyers, new consumer campaign, which was front, launched very recently. There's a brand new website that's up.

38:12

And it's a really exciting, really cool campaign where I think it's the most inclusive campaign I've ever seen before.

38:22

It really appeals to a young or technologically driven group of folks. It's for asthma biologic.

38:30

And it connects with those folks in a way that use a storytelling that's relevant to them into their experience.

38:40

But thinking about diversity inclusion, there's a lot of socio cultural history that we could go into just in terms of mistrust of of institutions and government amongst various groups in the population, inadequate access to healthcare resources.

39:00

So all of those things are are topics that we should be thinking about as well as a, as a position of responsibility, as a pharmaceutical manufacturer.

39:10

Um, and so it's also, while it's, I think, addressing diversity and inclusion from the patient perspective.

39:21

one of the things that we're also focused on is a lack of representation, which I think is not talked about as often in the healthcare industry.

39:28

What's going to lead to unconscious bias?

39:30

It can lead to ineffective communication.

39:34

And so, as researchers, as marketers, I think it's incumbent upon us to also, again, understand those issues behind health care professionals.

39:46

And so from, again, somewhat of an aside, but from a physician perspective.

39:52

We're also working to bring personas and helping two dimensional ize the patient, and some of the assets that we're putting in front of physicians as well, to continue to adopt and drive those, those best practices as a means to address the topic of diversity inclusion.

40:13

That's great. Awesome. Thank you. I know we were over time. Thank you to all of you who stayed on. Or if you had to drop off, as Elen mentioned, this will be, this is being, this has been recorded, are still being recorded. I would like to really extend my thanks to the three of you, Alicia, Patrick. Aakash. Thank you so much for doing this for joining. For those of you in the audience, we didn't get to any questions because we ran over, we would be happy to address those. And otherwise, thank you all for your time.

40:44

Thanks for taking the time to everyone who joined, and hope you have a good rest of the day.